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Panorama last night

Originally Posted by Tomcat It's as much a social thing as religious, if not more so. If the community you choose to live in accepts ...

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    Default Re: Panorama last night

    Quote Originally Posted by Tomcat View Post
    It's as much a social thing as religious, if not more so. If the community you choose to live in accepts the use of this (in effect) informal arbitration system, you are expected to abide by it or lose the support of that community. Anyone who isn't prepared to go by its findings shouldn't enter the system, and it would be wrong to suggest that every Muslim in the UK does. There's plenty of instances of social peer pressure among white communities, even if we don't give them funny forrin names.

    It remains that Sharia "courts" have no legally binding basis in the UK, nor are they "gang law" nor is anyone obliged to use them.
    So if a plaintiff brings a case to a Sharia court, it's entirely voluntary for the defendant to attend? I can see that working.
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    Default Re: Panorama last night

    Quote Originally Posted by Back-Marcus View Post
    So if a plaintiff brings a case to a Sharia court, it's entirely voluntary for the defendant to attend? I can see that working.

    Thats exactly the point. Businesses, marriage/divorces, land issues, neighbourly disputes, all of these can be dealt with by a Sharia court and the people accept the decision even if disadvantaged by it.
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    Default Re: Panorama last night

    Quote Originally Posted by Tomcat View Post
    It's as much a social thing as religious, if not more so. If the community you choose to live in accepts the use of this (in effect) informal arbitration system, you are expected to abide by it or lose the support of that community. Anyone who isn't prepared to go by its findings shouldn't enter the system, and it would be wrong to suggest that every Muslim in the UK does. There's plenty of instances of social peer pressure among white communities, even if we don't give them funny forrin names.

    It remains that Sharia "courts" have no legally binding basis in the UK, nor are they "gang law" nor is anyone obliged to use them.
    Ah it's as simple as that eh?

    No pressure or intimidation from their families and communities?

    Nothing to do with being brought up by oppressive bullying males then?

    Ever heard of forced marriages? Honour killings ?

    You do write some bollox at times TC.
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    Default Re: Panorama last night

    This is hardly an Islamic idea (although I agree there's a fair bit of peer pressure going on). Did you know for example that Judge Judy, for all it's pretentions of being "real courtroom, real cases" is actually just a voluntary arbitration service, hence why she can only rule up to $5000.
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    Default Re: Panorama last night

    Quote Originally Posted by Back-Marcus View Post
    So if a plaintiff brings a case to a Sharia court, it's entirely voluntary for the defendant to attend? I can see that working.
    If you have a prang with someone in your car, you might decide to leave the insurace company out of it and just settle the money privately. This is perfectly legal (I know it's not necessarily that simple, just work with me here FFS).

    If you then discover that your damage is much greater than you thought, you can still get the insurance company involved and go 'through the courts' so to speak, again still perfectly legal. The fact you intially decided not to involve the companies doesn't prevent you from doing it later.

    I'm sure you can get your head around that. Why such a problem with Sharia law?
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    Default Re: Panorama last night

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Dazzle View Post
    If you have a prang with someone in your car, you might decide to leave the insurace company out of it and just settle the money privately. This is perfectly legal (I know it's not necessarily that simple, just work with me here FFS).

    If you then discover that your damage is much greater than you thought, you can still get the insurance company involved and go 'through the courts' so to speak, again still perfectly legal. The fact you intially decided not to involve the companies doesn't prevent you from doing it later.

    I'm sure you can get your head around that. Why such a problem with Sharia law?
    Your comaprison has a major flaw in it. The "not through the insurance" example only works when both parties agree on the fault and the resolution, without anyone esle getting involved.

    If the Muslims with the dispute could resolve their arguments in the same way, there'd be no need for the Sharia court to get involved would there?
    The Sharia court is used once the 2 parties can't resolve it wthout court intervention.

    It isn't as voluntary as is being made out. In these comunities, if you don't go with the Sahria court ruling, you'd be outcast from that comunity.
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    Default Re: Panorama last night

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Dazzle View Post
    If you have a prang with someone in your car, you might decide to leave the insurace company out of it and just settle the money privately. This is perfectly legal (I know it's not necessarily that simple, just work with me here FFS).

    If you then discover that your damage is much greater than you thought, you can still get the insurance company involved and go 'through the courts' so to speak, again still perfectly legal. The fact you intially decided not to involve the companies doesn't prevent you from doing it later.

    I'm sure you can get your head around that. Why such a problem with Sharia law?
    The comparison is invalid if vulnerable women are being led to believe they have no choice and who are also badly advised by the court as to their rights.

    Here is the view of ex-muslim, human rights activist Maryam Namazie.

    BBC Panorama Programme on Sharia: It is enough now Maryam Namazie
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    Default Re: Panorama last night

    Quote Originally Posted by Back-Marcus View Post
    So if a plaintiff brings a case to a Sharia court, it's entirely voluntary for the defendant to attend? I can see that working.
    It's a bit like you and you neighbour having a dispute, you want me to decide who is right. If he agree, no problem, I decide and you both accept my decision. If he doesn't like me as an arbiter he tells me to take a hike. If I still decide (say in your favour) he is in no way bound to accept that. And neither you, nor I, can enforce my decision.
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    Default Re: Panorama last night

    Quote Originally Posted by Cousin Jack View Post
    It's a bit like you and you neighbour having a dispute, you want me to decide who is right. If he agree, no problem, I decide and you both accept my decision. If he doesn't like me as an arbiter he tells me to take a hike. If I still decide (say in your favour) he is in no way bound to accept that. And neither you, nor I, can enforce my decision.
    Now try that with vulnerable women as this is the main cause of worry for people or it really should be , Sharia has no place in the western world simply because it bullys the woman folk into taking a judgement

    Woe betide them if they then go against it and take it to a REAL civil court
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    Default Re: Panorama last night

    Quote Originally Posted by oldboy View Post
    The comparison is invalid if vulnerable women are being led to believe they have no choice and who are also badly advised by the court as to their rights.
    People that "vulnerable" will always find life difficult.
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    Default Re: Panorama last night

    Quote Originally Posted by Airtank View Post
    Now try that with vulnerable women as this is the main cause of worry for people or it really should be , Sharia has no place in the western world simply because it bullys the woman folk into taking a judgement

    Woe betide them if they then go against it and take it to a REAL civil court
    Why? If they go to a real court they will get a real decision, binding on them and the other party. And real courts actually have clout to enforce their decisions.

    And if you think all women are 'vulnerable' you obviously haven't met SWMBO.
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    Default Re: Panorama last night

    Quote Originally Posted by Cousin Jack View Post
    Why? If they go to a real court they will get a real decision, binding on them and the other party. And real courts actually have clout to enforce their decisions.

    And if you think all women are 'vulnerable' you obviously haven't met SWMBO.
    You know muslim women will not be allowed by their family's to take it past a sharia court for fear of some heavy retribution , At least you should know

    And yes when it comes to a bucket of acid or petrol women are very vulnerable , They are weird eh


    The BBC’s Panorama asks, are Sharia councils harming women? It includes a bit of undercover video in which a guy sitting high up as if he were a judge gives a woman a lot of very bad advice. He tells her she should be “brave” and ask the husband who hits her why he does it. “Is it my cooking?” That way she can correct herself.

    He also tells her that reporting the hitting to the police is the very last resort and that a shelter is terrible.
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    Default Re: Panorama last night

    Quote Originally Posted by Airtank View Post
    And yes when it comes to a bucket of acid or petrol women are very vulnerable
    So are men. Even hard men.
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    Default Re: Panorama last night

    Quote Originally Posted by Cousin Jack View Post
    So are men. Even hard men.
    You durty bastard , But if it floats yer boat eh
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