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Thread: Who is to blame for 'self-driving car' deaths?

  1. #91
    Should Get Out More mrlongbeard's Avatar
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    Default Re: Who is to blame for 'self-driving car' deaths?

    Quote Originally Posted by Horse View Post
    Actually, I doubt that, in the same circumstances (speed, following distance, how close the lead car is when it swerves), that a human driver would have avoided the crash either. It's a fair guess that the Tesla would have reacted more quickly and then applied and maintained maximum braking. Do you think a human could have avoided that crash (other than swerve too)?
    If it's a Tesla 3 then it's still crashing.

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    Default Re: Who is to blame for 'self-driving car' deaths?

    Quote Originally Posted by mrlongbeard View Post
    If it's a Tesla 3 then it's still crashing.
    But it wasn't, was it?


    Incidentally:
    https://trid.trb.org/view/1423831

    Although many research results on collision mitigation and avoidance systems have been published, little has been published on collision avoidance and mitigation systems which are similar to the decision‐making and driving characteristics of the human driver.

    To validate the performance of the system, test scenarios for a stationary target and low‐speed driving target were used. In case the velocity of the subject vehicle was below 50(km/h), the system can prevent the collision between the subject vehicle and the frontal vehicle. In case the velocity of the subject vehicle is over 50(km/h), the system mitigate the collision between the subject vehicle and the frontal vehicle. The authors conclude that the emergency braking system can be a good solution for enhancing vehicle safety and driver acceptance.

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    Default Re: Who is to blame for 'self-driving car' deaths?

    Quote Originally Posted by McNab View Post
    So Tesla think it's the all the drivers fault and it's ok that the car accelerated straight into a barrier. If I was a Tesla engineer, I would have thought of a better way to get the drivers attention.
    The driver. If you can't drive car with auto-pilot don't do it. The auto-pilots have their moral issues, if you are not prepared for that don't use them.

    For example if the car is to crash with 50mph at a tractor stopped on a bend and there is a bus stop full with kittens, the computer is programmed to kill the kittens and safe the driver instead. Human may decide not to kill other humans and hit the tractor.

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    Default Re: Who is to blame for 'self-driving car' deaths?

    Quote Originally Posted by Val View Post
    The driver. If you can't drive car with auto-pilot don't do it. The auto-pilots have their moral issues, if you are not prepared for that don't use them.

    For example if the car is to crash with 50mph at a tractor stopped on a bend and there is a bus stop full with kittens, the computer is programmed to kill the kittens and safe the driver instead. Human may decide not to kill other humans and hit the tractor.
    I'm sure you can link to a Tesla owner's manual or similar which supports such a bollox statement?

    AFAIK, Tesla's 'autopilot' is simply a glorified lane-steering and cruise control. It would know a 'moral' decision if bit the car in the bum

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    Should Get Out More mrlongbeard's Avatar
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    Default Re: Who is to blame for 'self-driving car' deaths?

    Quote Originally Posted by Val View Post
    The driver. If you can't drive car with auto-pilot don't do it. The auto-pilots have their moral issues, if you are not prepared for that don't use them.

    For example if the car is to crash with 50mph at a tractor stopped on a bend and there is a bus stop full with kittens, the computer is programmed to kill the kittens and safe the driver instead. Human may decide not to kill other humans and hit the tractor.
    That's a level 4/5 quandary which no one has answered yet, which is fine given all cars are currently only operating at level 2

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    Should Get Out More Tomcat's Avatar
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    Default Re: Who is to blame for 'self-driving car' deaths?

    Not really a self driving issue, but another Tesla blowtorches itself into oblivion...

    https://www.theguardian.com/technolo...ack-california

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    Default Re: Who is to blame for 'self-driving car' deaths?

    There's a recent news story about one that caught fire in a crash, was extinguished - but reignited a week later while in storage!

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    Default Re: Who is to blame for 'self-driving car' deaths?

    Quote Originally Posted by Horse View Post
    There's a recent news story about one that caught fire in a crash, was extinguished - but reignited a week later while in storage!
    I have a feeling that super-dense energy storage technology is not quite mature yet.

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    Default Re: Who is to blame for 'self-driving car' deaths?

    Quote Originally Posted by Horse View Post
    There's a recent news story about one that caught fire in a crash, was extinguished - but reignited a week later while in storage!
    Didn't I give the link above? The Tesla failed to choose between the main highway and an off-ramp and accelerated into the barrier between the two. Driver killed, and the battery caught fire during the incident. It took a long time and a lot of resources to put out, then reignited as you mention.

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    Default Re: Who is to blame for 'self-driving car' deaths?

    Fairynuff, couldn't remember where I'd seen it. Might have been here, LinkedIn, or one of various news feeds/emails, or from following a series of links.

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    Default Re: Who is to blame for 'self-driving car' deaths?

    https://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&rc...RxqxqYzglAeUsm

    Yes it's a long link For anyone interested in the insurance aspects, it takes you to a PDF of:
    Driverless cars: liability frameworks and safety by design
    Insurance and Legal report 2018

    For the 'Venturer' project:


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    Default Re: Who is to blame for 'self-driving car' deaths?

    Arizona Uber crash driver was 'watching TV'

    The "safety operator" of a self-driving Uber car was watching TV just before the vehicle was involved in a fatal collision, a police report reveals.

    The Uber car struck and killed pedestrian Elaine Herzberg, 49, of Tempe, Arizona in March.

    The police report suggests the car's driver was streaming an episode of talent show The Voice rather than monitoring the car's progress.

    It suggests she could face charges of vehicle manslaughter.

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    Default Re: Who is to blame for 'self-driving car' deaths?

    Some sad irony that she was watching a show called The Voice . . .

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