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Thread: Woodworkers, cabinet makers and timber butchers, lend me your ears!

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    Question Woodworkers, cabinet makers and timber butchers, lend me your ears!


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    Old house, yadda yadda, victorian doors, yadda yadda, previous bastards have had them stripped and at least two of them have sagged to the point where the latch misses the hole.

    Hinges are in the original pockets on both frame and door, there is a noticeable slant in the top of the door when referenced against header therefore I am pretty sure it is the door that is odds.

    Traditional 6 panel door with through mortices on the top and bottom rails, possibly blind mortices on the mid and upper rails.

    What can be done?

    How easy should it be to pull the bugger apart, square and glue it back together?

    Or is there an alternative way to true it up?

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    Default Re: Woodworkers, cabinet makers and timber butchers, lend me your ears!

    I've not done it to a door but I've done similar to a frame shed wall, Ratchet strap across diagonal top and bottom corners and tighten. Then batter with a hammer until the diagonals are equal, assuming the door was square to start with. Pin the door with dowels.

    AFAIK if the doors has been made properly you'll struggle to get the wedges out of the joints. Has someone rendered the one of middle mortices useless by cutting most of it out to fit a lock?

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    Default Re: Woodworkers, cabinet makers and timber butchers, lend me your ears!

    Quote Originally Posted by cheb View Post
    I've not done it to a door but I've done similar to a frame shed wall, Ratchet strap across diagonal top and bottom corners and tighten. Then batter with a hammer until the diagonals are equal, assuming the door was square to start with. Pin the door with dowels.

    AFAIK if the doors has been made properly you'll struggle to get the wedges out of the joints. Has someone rendered the one of middle mortices useless by cutting most of it out to fit a lock?
    I'll have a look at the latch placement, but I strongly suspect you are right as it sits in the middle rail.

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    Default Re: Woodworkers, cabinet makers and timber butchers, lend me your ears!

    Found this:

    It sounds as if you'll need to rebuild the door.

    To do that you'll need to remove some, if not all, paint from the door.


    If you don't want to remove all paint, you'll need to remove at least enough paint to reveal where the frame and stiles are pegged together.


    Then you'll need to remove those pins. you can try to figure out which side they were drivin in from and thenm try to knock them out, or you can just drill them out.


    Once the pegs are out, heat a joint with a heat gun or an iron. This should help lossen the old hide glue enough so that you can knock the joint apart with a hammer. If the door has through tennons (you can see where the cross member of the door sticks through the side member) then you should look for wedges that may have been drivin into the back of the joint to help secure it. If you ahve these, they'll also have to be removed before you can knock the door apart.


    Once the door is apart, (be sure to keep the pieces in proper order) use some sandpaper, or warm water and ascraper to remove the old glue from the surfaces of each joint. Don't remove any wood - just glue and paint!


    once you've cleaned the joints up, get yourself some clamps (lots of clamps) and make up some new pins out of a hardwood dowel. (available from any lumber yard)


    The old ones were probably square, so buy your dowel large enough so that you can trim it square in a size that will still fill the hole.


    When you glue the door back together, DO NOT GLUE THE PANELS IN PLACE. The panels are meant to float within the frame. If they are secured, and not allowed to move, seasonal changes in humidity will cause the wood to expand and contract and they will eventually crack or push the frame apart.


    You can use elmers yellow glue or titebond yellow glue to put these back together, although if they're exterior doors, be sure to use a waterproof glue. If you are doing a completely orthodox restoration of the house, you should read up on and learn how to work with hide glue and use that instead of a modern product.


    If some of the terms that I used don't make sense to you, do a google search about furniture building, or mortise and tennon joinery, or frame and panel door construction and you'll find some info to explain things in greater detail.


    You may also be able to have a skilled woodworker repair the door for you, although anyone that is willing to do this for you should be made aware of wheter or not modern materials anhd methods will be acceptable for use on the door.


    Best of Luck!


    HB
    I suspect a lot of it will be akin to Haynes and reassembly is simply the reverse of disassembly when it comes down to being able dismantle the joints...

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    Default Re: Woodworkers, cabinet makers and timber butchers, lend me your ears!

    Update: All rails are through mortice joints and as cehb expected, the lactch/lock goes straight through the middle rail joint.

    I'm tempted to create a jig on the floor with 3x2s and see if I can knock/pull/push it square in the first instance.

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    Default Re: Woodworkers, cabinet makers and timber butchers, lend me your ears!

    I'd suspect that they've been stripped by boiling in caustic and that stripped all the glue too.

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    Default Re: Woodworkers, cabinet makers and timber butchers, lend me your ears!

    Quote Originally Posted by cheb View Post
    I'd suspect that they've been stripped by boiling in caustic and that stripped all the glue too.
    That's my guess too and the reason for the sag. If plan A fails then I'll have to look and trying to pull the wedges and joints to fully restore the doors. It'll be good practice for sorting the storm doors out...

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