Running Total loss electrics on a trackbike

**Craigyboy9** · 06-10-18, 14:39

Long and short of it is, GSXR 750 K6 broke down while I was away at Alcarras before lunch on the first day. Either the stator or the reg/rec or both are shagged. I bought a brand new battery and ran it day two and three charging it overnight and between sessions with the stator and reg/rec unplugged and it never missed a beat. Just on the off chance does anyone run a fuel injected trackbike/racebike like this all the time?

**Tomcat** · 06-10-18, 14:48

I ran a pre-injection CBR600 like that. It made no apparent difference to power, and I had to charge it at lunch time. As long as you don't mind frequent battery swaps it shouldn't cause any problems.

**a_morti** · 06-10-18, 18:36

What he said. Just think of electricity as a thing you can run out of like petrol and you'll be ok. Might be worth fitting a voltage meter so you know when that's going to happen. Batteries (typical lead acid type) don't like being run down to zero. So swap batteries as often as possible.

**Craigyboy9** · 06-10-18, 21:09

Originally Posted by Tomcat

I ran a pre-injection CBR600 like that. It made no apparent difference to power, and I had to charge it at lunch time. As long as you don't mind frequent battery swaps it shouldn't cause any problems.

I knew lots of guys ran the pre injection bikes total loss, but the draw on the battery is much less as there’s little in the way to run apart from the spark and the dash, but with an FI machine it’s a lot more. I’m not thinking of doing it to save weight or gain any horses, just to remove the problem ( and it is a well documented problem with these bikes) out of the equation. I’m thinkinb that having to spend £100 on a couple of new batteries every year isn’t really that big a deal if it means no more bloody breakdowns.

**Craigyboy9** · 06-10-18, 21:11

Originally Posted by a_morti

What he said. Just think of electricity as a thing you can run out of like petrol and you'll be ok. Might be worth fitting a voltage meter so you know when that's going to happen. Batteries (typical lead acid type) don't like being run down to zero. So swap batteries as often as possible.

Was thinking of buying a couple of deep cycle gel batteries for next year and I had planned on fitting a meter wether I replaced the charging system or not. They very often over charge the battery when things go wrong. I think I’ve probably killed my £80 lithium ion battery. Grrrr.

**KungFooBob** · 06-10-18, 21:17

If you remove the charging circuit you'll save weight... and if you remove the alternator from the end of the crank you'll get 1-2bhp from reducing the parasitic drag... maybe.

I'd just fix the charging circuit.

**Yorick** · 06-10-18, 21:32

Originally Posted by KungFooBob

If you remove the charging circuit you'll save weight... and if you remove the alternator from the end of the crank you'll get 1-2bhp from reducing the parasitic drag... maybe.

I'd just fix the charging circuit.

Or have a reet good shit.

**Craigyboy9** · 07-10-18, 08:32

Originally Posted by Yorick

Or have a reet good shit.

You can put your mortgage on it, as soon as the leathers are on and the bikes warmed up and it’s about 2 minutes to the start of the session, I’ll need to go!

**Tomcat** · 07-10-18, 10:51

Originally Posted by a_morti

Batteries (typical lead acid type) don't like being run down to zero. So swap batteries as often as possible.

I could be wrong here, but I thought it was Li cells that didn't like being run right down. Lead-acid from what I recall like deep cycling to keep them healthy.

Originally Posted by Craigyboy9

I knew lots of guys ran the pre injection bikes total loss, but the draw on the battery is much less as there’s little in the way to run apart from the spark and the dash, but with an FI machine it’s a lot more. I’m not thinking of doing it to save weight or gain any horses, just to remove the problem ( and it is a well documented problem with these bikes) out of the equation. I’m thinking that having to spend £100 on a couple of new batteries every year isn’t really that big a deal if it means no more bloody breakdowns.

I know what you mean, there is inevitably more current draw on an injected bike. And don't forget electric starting as well. I'd just say suck it and see, if you can get through half a day on a battery you don't have a problem. It might reduce the value of the bike when you come to sell it but that's a problem for another day.

**Craigyboy9** · 07-10-18, 17:33

Originally Posted by Tomcat

I could be wrong here, but I thought it was Li cells that didn't like being run right down. Lead-acid from what I recall like deep cycling to keep them healthy.

I know what you mean, there is inevitably more current draw on an injected bike. And don't forget electric starting as well. I'd just say suck it and see, if you can get through half a day on a battery you don't have a problem. It might reduce the value of the bike when you come to sell it but that's a problem for another day.

That’s my train of theought here TC, if and when I come to sell it, I may or may not stick a stator and reg/rec on it. It’s more than fast enough for me and I love riding it, so I’ve no plans to sell it any time soon.

**davidat19** · 08-10-18, 16:39

Stick an ammeter on it while its running and make the calculation as to how long it can run before dragging the battery too far down. Simples.

**X81** · 23-10-18, 13:52

I wouldn't run a total loss system on an injected bike without having full access to all of the mapping data.

Many injection systems will run a battery voltage compensation table which manipulates the main fuel injection table against battery voltage.

As voltage drops so can fuel pressure which will lean your fuelling out. Injection systems like constants i've found and something like fuel pressure and battery voltage are two very very big ones that you need stability with. You might be ok, then again you might not. no one will know unless you can see all the look up tables in the original ECU which you'll not be able to.

Most Injection systems will take around 1v just to remain powered up, then there's the draw of the fuel pump, plus coil packs and then injectors, totall loss will just cause you grief in the long run.

Invest in a lithium battery and see if you can find someone who can make a lighter generator if that's what you want to do but don't just junk it, injection is more reliant on the whole electrical system than carbs where.

**stoo** · 23-10-18, 14:56

Originally Posted by Tomcat

Lead-acid from what I recall like deep cycling to keep them healthy.

I thought that only applied to certain types of lead-acid batteries - the ones designed for use as leisure batteries or for uninterruptible power supplies are a different construction to automotive ones designed to supply a hefty amount of cold start cranking amps.... and that the automotive type weren't meant to be deep cycled. Maybe modern lead acid batteries are better at both though?

**Sean Cross** · 08-01-19, 14:29

I ran a pre-injection CBR600 like that

**Craigyboy9** · 24-01-19, 19:05

Finally got round to doing something about this charging system today. I’ve charged the battery and run the bike to get numbers for the stator. It’s giving out 20v across each phase at tick over and around 80v across each phase at 5000rpm. The service manual says it should be greater than 65v which it obviously is, but it’s well over that. Does the TRC think this is ok?