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Thread: What takes precedence, respecting someone's beliefs or LGBT sensitivities?

  1. #31
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    Default Re: What takes precedence, respecting someone's beliefs or LGBT sensitivities?


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    Quote Originally Posted by Screwdriver View Post
    homosexuality. I am uncomfortable with the idea (mainly the nitty gritty sordid details) but perfectly fine with the notion; it is an expression of love after all. But you can't teach an old dog new tricks and try as I might, I can't abide the idea of two men having sex.
    Are you conflating 'love between two people' and 'penetrative anal sex' - which are two very different things. Also both two things which some heterosexual couples engage in.

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    Default Re: What takes precedence, respecting someone's beliefs or LGBT sensitivities?

    Quote Originally Posted by irie View Post
    Even if this Bill started from the beginning again it is very unlikely to be lost.

    I have a particular interest in this Bill but will not explain why.
    Foal was educated in the state system, but I have a fair bit of knowledge of EHO.

    The sooner it's more controlled, the better for the kids concerned. IIRC, the government don't even know (or CBA to try again work out, or don't want to know) how many EHO kids there are.

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    Default Re: What takes precedence, respecting someone's beliefs or LGBT sensitivities?

    Quote Originally Posted by jane View Post
    inkyboy doesn't really understand what 'facts' are or how they come to be facts. he assumes, for example, that heterosexuality and homosexuality are facts in a scientific sense. because human reprooduction is dependent on large gametes (female) + small gametes (male). but if you take a look at different cultures over different eras (ancient greece, for eg) you see that this distinction between heterosexuality and homosexuality wasn't always present. they certainly knew what male and female are, and they knew how to make babies, but there was no sense that social relations had reflect biological ones in the way we do now. Human sexuality, as we now see it, is to a significant extent result of certain economic/social/technological factors.

    when inky talks about ideology what he means is the actions of trans activists, but the actions of trans activists (when ideologically driven) and the existence of trans people (a social fact) are not synonymous. it is entirely possible to explain the existence of trans people without engaging in brainwashing. (dualist woo)

    now i'm not gonna address the political ramifications of this stuff, because it's up to you how you process it/incorporate it into your belief systems (whether secualr or otherwise), but i would like to explain some of the philosophical issues at work when we talk about whether you can change sex/gender, that is if anyone cares...*


    * yeah, i know
    It’s nice that your still so interested in my tiny mind and some of that is actually true. I could be interested in your conversation too, when and if you ever leave your hobbyhorses behind.

    Were I an Ancient Greek, I might well have shagged my best mate in the army and also had a wife and kids. In today’s “Western” society I live happily as a heterosexual geezer and have no interest at all in doing dudes.

    There is pressure for schools to do some trans brainwashing with woo. I don’t know if that’s what this school is doing.

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    Default Re: What takes precedence, respecting someone's beliefs or LGBT sensitivities?

    Quote Originally Posted by Trogladyte View Post
    Respecting beliefs is not unconditional. Nazis and fascists have beliefs, and I disrespect them. And a lot of other shit, too.
    Do you purposefully disrespect - indeed, will you even tolerate - my belief that sex between 2 men is wrong?
    I'm not sure that equates me with Nazis and fascists, but maybe that is your belief?
    I don't think the state should ban it; I think it was wrong to ban it when it was banned; many things are wrong but have no need of being banned.
    I am fine with the state 'educating' children, at the appropriate age, that some men do have sex with other men btw as that is a fact.
    Indeed, it is likely that by an appropriate time my children would have been well aware that some men have sex with other men.

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    Should Get Out More Screwdriver's Avatar
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    Default Re: What takes precedence, respecting someone's beliefs or LGBT sensitivities?

    Quote Originally Posted by Horse View Post
    Are you conflating 'love between two people' and 'penetrative anal sex' - which are two very different things. Also both two things which some heterosexual couples engage in.
    I am not conflating anything. I said what I meant and I mean what I say. I an not proud of my prejudice but it is ingrained and not a conscious decision. I do not care to discuss the gory details, I am pretty sure I made myself clear. If you want to discuss anal sex, you need to speak to someone else.

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    Default Re: What takes precedence, respecting someone's beliefs or LGBT sensitivities?

    I find the way Halal meat is killed is disgusting. It's legal, but I still find it disgusting. The same as sex between 2 men. If it's legal for them, it's just as legal for me to find it abhorrent.

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    Default Re: What takes precedence, respecting someone's beliefs or LGBT sensitivities?

    Quote Originally Posted by Yorick View Post
    I find the way Halal meat is killed is disgusting. It's legal, but I still find it disgusting. The same as sex between 2 men. If it's legal for them, it's just as legal for me to find it abhorrent.
    Never confuse bumming with throat-cutting.

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    Default Re: What takes precedence, respecting someone's beliefs or LGBT sensitivities?

    Quote Originally Posted by Screwdriver View Post
    I am not conflating anything. I said what I meant and I mean what I say. I an not proud of my prejudice but it is ingrained and not a conscious decision. I do not care to discuss the gory details, I am pretty sure I made myself clear. If you want to discuss anal sex, you need to speak to someone else.
    The simple fact that I thought it necessary to post a comment shows that you weren't clear. Others may have understood your meaning, I didn't.

    I don't 'need' to discuss the details, and your reticence to be clear only emphasises your feelings.

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    Default Re: What takes precedence, respecting someone's beliefs or LGBT sensitivities?

    I couldn't give a flying fuck about anyone's religious beliefs. Religions believe some really stupid and at times hateful stuff so for me they don't take precedence over anything, at all.

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    Default Re: What takes precedence, respecting someone's beliefs or LGBT sensitivities?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kneerly Down View Post
    Do you purposefully disrespect - indeed, will you even tolerate - my belief that sex between 2 men is wrong?
    I don't agree, but as long as you can keep it to yourself, you're entitled to an opinion.

    Quote Originally Posted by Yorick View Post
    I find the way Halal meat is killed is disgusting. It's legal, but I still find it disgusting. The same as sex between 2 men. If it's legal for them, it's just as legal for me to find it abhorrent.
    Exactly.

    There are plenty of things in life that you don't have to like, but you still ought to let people get on with in peace, assuming they're not breaking the law nor hurting anyone including themselves.

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    Default Re: What takes precedence, respecting someone's beliefs or LGBT sensitivities?

    Quote Originally Posted by a_morti View Post
    I don't agree, but as long as you can keep it to yourself, you're entitled to an opinion.
    What do you mean "keep it to yourself"?

    Do you mean I shouldn't be allowed to say that it is what I believe, that I shouldn't be allowed to say to my children that is what I believe?

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    Default Re: What takes precedence, respecting someone's beliefs or LGBT sensitivities?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kneerly Down View Post
    What do you mean "keep it to yourself"?

    Do you mean I shouldn't be allowed to say that it is what I believe, that I shouldn't be allowed to say to my children that is what I believe?
    Believe what you like. Just don't try and convert me and don't spoil the happiness of the gays just because you don't like what they do.

    Telling your kids that you believe two people don't deserve to find happiness together just because they both have penises is a close neighbour to teaching them to believe the same thing.

    Everyone has the right to enjoy their life and like or dislike what they want, and that's easier if everyone tolerates everyone else doing that. Even if they find it difficult. Including me tolerating your outdated beliefs.

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    Default Re: What takes precedence, respecting someone's beliefs or LGBT sensitivities?

    Anyway, to the original question. The kids deserve to hear both sides, they can then make up their own minds. Hopefully whatever they decide, they will go through life tolerating the other side of that coin.

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    Default Re: What takes precedence, respecting someone's beliefs or LGBT sensitivities?

    I'm going to be travelling on a ferry today, something that various churches campaigned against up here for many years, and some still do.

    IMO religious belief is a choice and a person's sexuality isn't, ergo religion comes second.

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    Default Re: What takes precedence, respecting someone's beliefs or LGBT sensitivities?

    brb - just writing some screwd gay fanfic...

    'Screwdriver grasped Martian's cock* and pulled him closer, he could feel the thick veins throbbing and his hot breath...'







    *don't pretend like you've never thought about it, marshy
    Last edited by jane; 22-09-19 at 10:48.

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