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Thread: Why is there so little air intake tuning going on?

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    Default Why is there so little air intake tuning going on?


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    Lots of people are getting performance exhausts and remaps. Don't they need to get more air in? Isn't it a bit of a waste to get the pipe and map if you don't pimp the airbox? Sometimes they swap the stock filter for a K&N one, but that's a rather tiny step to take. Where are all the enlarged air boxes and the bolt-on intake tubes? I reckon it would be fun to make some and see what they do on the dyno.

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    Should Get Out More ink ink's Avatar
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    Default Re: Why is there so little air intake tuning going on?

    Yes it should be possible to make you’re bike significantly slower, with only a few expensive bolt-on parts.

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    Should Get Out More KungFooBob's Avatar
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    Default Re: Why is there so little air intake tuning going on?

    Unless you compress the air, only so much will fit in an engine at any given time. If the standard airbox and filter flow that amount then there's no point fucking about with them.

    There's some interesting stuff going on with variable intake tracts, etc... but if you want to get more air in, you need forced induction.

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    Should Get Out More a_morti's Avatar
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    Default Re: Why is there so little air intake tuning going on?

    Modern bikes need to be quiet. So you get baffles in the airbox, flapper valves, etc. Same as in the exhaust.

    It's past the days of CV carbs where even touching the airbox would fk your bike up forever. As long as you know the bike will need a bit of Dyno time (or buy a power commander 5 with auto tune), I don't see why you shouldn't gut the airbox, if you didn't mind the extra noise.

    That's worth mentioning too. Loud exhausts give everyone else a headache. Loud airboxes get real old for the rider, real fast.

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    Default Re: Why is there so little air intake tuning going on?

    Well I suppose that's only fair. I'm not a fan of noise pollution.

    What can the PC5 manage? If you were to go as far as you can without changing the engine internals....a catless illegal full exhaust, enlarged/derestricted airbox, bigger air intakes, can the PC5 come up with the optimal map without human intervention on a dyno? I've been reading about the Dimsport Rapid Bike Evo, and it seems to promise that sort of thing. I've no idea how it compares with the PC.
    Last edited by nick h.; 18-11-19 at 22:34.

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    Default Re: Why is there so little air intake tuning going on?

    Air boxes are easily pressured to the right level. That's a given. The computer takes over to mix the fuel/air ratio.


    Non event story really.

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    Default Re: Why is there so little air intake tuning going on?

    Quote Originally Posted by Yorick View Post
    Air boxes are easily pressured to the right level. That's a given. The computer takes over to mix the fuel/air ratio.


    Non event story really.
    So what happens when a new map requests more fuel?

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    Default Re: Why is there so little air intake tuning going on?

    Quote Originally Posted by nick h. View Post
    So what happens when a new map requests more fuel?
    What happens when a horse requests more food?

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    Default Re: Why is there so little air intake tuning going on?

    Quote Originally Posted by nick h. View Post
    Well I suppose that's only fair. I'm not a fan of noise pollution.

    What can the PC5 manage? If you were to go as far as you can without changing the engine internals....a catless illegal full exhaust, enlarged/derestricted airbox, bigger air intakes, can the PC5 come up with the optimal map without human intervention on a dyno? I've been reading about the Dimsport Rapid Bike Evo, and it seems to promise that sort of thing. I've no idea how it compares with the PC.
    PCV can be on its own and rely on your Dyno guy spending his time / your money setting it up. Or you can add an autotune box and a wideband O2 sensor. With that, you get a "close enough" map off the web, then as you ride around at various throttle openings and engine loading, the bike learns what it has to do to achieve the target air fuel ratio you set. You can go full lean burn for efficiency or a bit richer for cooling purposes or whatever you want, and it'll figure it out.

    Quote Originally Posted by Yorick View Post
    What happens when a horse requests more food?
    It gets it, and goes faster. Or the trainer doesn't listen and it falls down exhausted during the race.

    Anyway, come clean nick? What POS are you hoping to make faster?

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    Default Re: Why is there so little air intake tuning going on?

    Quote Originally Posted by Yorick View Post
    What happens when a horse requests more food?
    It stamps its front foot twice.

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    Default Re: Why is there so little air intake tuning going on?

    Most people fit a different exhaust for looks and noise, not to make the bike any quicker, you can't see the airbox so why twat about with it.

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    Default Re: Why is there so little air intake tuning going on?

    O'Rly

    K&N by MrLongbeard, on Flickr

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    Default Re: Why is there so little air intake tuning going on?

    There is more to intake tuning than just airbox size and pressure. There is baffle plates opposite intakes controlling resonance and lengthening intake trumpets or velocity stacks as they're known is also a known improvement and shaping intake ports with epoxy ramps allegedly creating better atomised mixes etc.

    I think whats happened is, bikes are just so powerful now its seen as a better way forward to simply iron out the fuelling issues and just smooth things out. A lot of the tuning of yesteryear was about top end power and its just not needed anymore as datalogging has shown full throttle is used a hell of lot less than people previously thought and gains in the midrange are much more beneficial.

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    Default Re: Why is there so little air intake tuning going on?

    There used to be tuning of induction systems, (I've done some a long time ago) because factory intakes were absolutely shite, and mostly aimed at reducing induction noise and keeping crap out of the bores. port shapes used to be less than optimal because they were designed for ease of manufacture rather than power. Back in the day (70s and early 80s bikes) a set of K&N pod filters, new jets and a free flow exhaust would make a noticeable difference on their own, a skimmed and flowed head (possibly with a cam) like wise, and both were easily accessible to the home / shed tuner. Modern engines are designed with the benefit of CFD to optimise airflow through the intake system, ports can be designed to maximise flow as CNC machining and more advanced casting systems became available. Modern (and for me that starts mid 90s) bikes have sufficient power straight out of the box that for the vast majority of users there isn't any need/desire to spend a lot of time and money doing mods that will only give marginal improvements. Very few road riders would notice the improvements from induction tweaks on a modern bike (shy of forced induction anyway). On the upside if you're into such things, small, reliable turbo systems and intercoolers are now available cheap and they will definitely make a difference, but they require more work to install than a set of pods and jets.

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    Default Re: Why is there so little air intake tuning going on?

    Quote Originally Posted by a_morti View Post
    What POS are you hoping to make faster?
    Maybe the R1250GS or RS. I don't own either. Haven't ridden them. And I'm not sure I could cope with the shame of inflicting a loud pipe on the general public. But I'm curious because I had such fun years ago giving the super moto treatment to previous models of the GS. The published power curves are intriguing. Imagine how good the bike would feel if you could convert the dips into straight lines? Here's an Akrapovic chart for an illegal full system:



    Here's a Bennetts one:




    What with it being Euro 5 compliant and a BMW you would think there'd be lots of scope for straightening the graphs by ditching the emissions gubbins. But I've not found much tuning info from googling. There's a drag racer based on the R1250RS. It has a pair of K&Ns and no airbox. But it also has nitrous, so forget it.



    And there's a dyno shop in South Africa which claims to have got a 15bhp increase from a GS. https://www.facebook.com/RapidSouthA...8476485781406/

    Then again, I could get more power for less money without any noise issues just by buying a used S1000XR...

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